Interview

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photo by: thomas billingsley photography

Updated: 08.09.03

(Note: All Rights Reserved, please contact Dancers with a Dream to reprint any information from this interview)

Why did you decide to relocate to England?

C: Well, it definitely was not a quick and easy decision.  We had been thinking about it for quite some time before we actually made it a reality.  Two years ago, we came fourth at our second Canadian Closed Championships.  We thought:  If we could get that far, dancing for only two years together, then what's stopping us from going further?  That's when we decided to dedicate our lives to becoming the best dancers we could possibly be.

J: During the past few years, we have travelled consistently to England during the weeks prior to the major championships.   Every single trip was an inspiration.  Not only did we received the highest quality coaching, but we also were surrounded by all the top dancers in the world.   Nothing can motivate you more than a ballroom full of the world's top amateurs and professionals dancing right beside you during practice.  It's a true test if you can swing with the big guns.  It's a feeling that we always craved when we returned back to Canada.

   Furthermore, our goal to raise our international ranking could only be accomplished if we competed more at the major championships in England and throughout Continental Europe.  With London as our "home base", we are able to compete every weekend if we want to.  This just would not be possible in Canada, no matter how much we travelled across our huge country.  Also, flights from London to Germany, France, Austria, Denmark, Italy, etc. can be are very, very cheap.  There are a number of discount airlines who sell round trip tickets to Italy for as little as £16.00!  That's about $40 Canadian!

C: Yes, the ability to travel to various competitions throughout Europe is a huge bonus!  There aren't many competitions going on back home during this time, so in order to continually challenge ourselves and test our skills, we have to go elsewhere to compete. 

   For the past year now, we have been contemplating the move to England, but we were never 100% sure.   After coming second at the Canadian Championships in Vancouver, the decision was clear.  The timing just seemed to be perfect.  We plan to train in England before the World Championships in November, and hopefully stay on as long as we can.      

Moving to the other side of the world must have been difficult...

C: Actually, it wasn't as difficult as we had originally thought.  Since we had taken several training trips to London in the past, we had already gotten used to certain parts of everyday life.  i.e. taking the trains, going to practices and lessons and trying to fit in three meals a day.    I think the hardest thing to get used to is spending the British pound.   Paying for groceries and such, at what seem like reasonable Canadian prices, makes you crazy when you realize that there is a 2.3 times conversion to the Canadian dollar!

J:  The biggest thing for me was trying to pack my life into a few suitcases.  With all the travelling we've been doing over the past few years, we're quite used to living out of suitcases, but this trip was a little different.  We're not sure exactly when we'll be back home, so we had to pack thinking that we'd be away for at least 6 months.  That meant packing summer, fall and winter clothing.

Now that you're in England, what's the most difficult thing to adjust to?

J:  I have to admit that I miss my parent's car.  Here in London, I've now gotten used to walking 15 minutes to the train stations and bus stops, something very un-North American.  Back home, people spend an extra 5 minutes in the car circling around a parking lot just to find a free spot a few feet closer to the front door.  That's already so foreign for me.   I kinda think of all this walking as a supplement to my dance training.  Heck, every step I take makes me that much stronger on the floor!

C: Yes, I would have to agree that I have never walked this much in my entire life!  Even when we used the public transit system back home and in Toronto, I never had to walk as much as I am now.  The way the transportation system is built here in London, with all it's connections between, buses, tube (subway), trains and trams, forces you to do a lot of walking to and from the different stations. 

   One of the most difficult things for me to adjust to is the lack of air conditioning in the studios, buses, and trains.  In North America, you are hit with the air conditioning as soon as you walk in the door.  But over here in London, air conditioning is very uncommon.   On a hot summer day, it is terribly uncomfortable to be going from a stifling hot bus to a stuffy, non-air conditioned studio, packed with sweaty dancers.  It's like dancing in a sauna, really!

  
Although you've only been in England for a short period of time, have there been any highlights so far?

J:  We have already had the opportunity to work with some more coaches that we usually would not have been able to learn from.  We have had lessons with Marcus & Karen Hilton, John Wood and Anne Gleave.  To get lessons with these coaches during the weeks prior to the major championships entails one to book about 2 years in advance!  Now that we live here, and have a more flexible schedule, lesson bookings are a lot easier. 

   Also, although the length of practice time is limited, the atmosphere is usually very positive.  It is not uncommon for us to be practicing alongside other top couples from around the world that have also relocated here to London.  There must be at least 4-5 different countries represented at every practice.  These dancers really push us to do everything with that much more quality.   We know that we'll be competing with a lot of these couples at the next competition, so although it's a friendly practice, it is still very intense.

C:  Yes, the best thing about being here is definitely the dancing environment.  Being surrounded by past, present and future champions is absolutely inspiring.  The environment itself breeds quality dancers.  We can feel it happenning.  We are more confident than ever that this move to England is going to help us achieve our dancing dreams.      

Is there anything else you'd like to add?

We would both like to mention that our move to London couldn't have been possible without the continual support of various people.  We would specifically like to thank our major corporate sponsors, Roy and Terri Maguire of ADT Security Services.  We would also like to thank all of the people that came out and supported our Summer Magic fundraiser in July, as well as those who sent us donations.  There are numerous other people and organizations that have supported us throughout our journey, and their names can be found on our Contributors page.

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Why did you get into ballroom dancing?

C: I’ve always been interested in dancing.  When I was 5, my mom enrolled me into ballet lessons, and I just hated it.  I decided to quit even before the session was over.   My mom tried to get me dancing again when I was 10 years old, and this time she had better luck.   I started to like it and continued to do Chinese folk dancing and Jazz for the next 5 years.  My dad is also very appreciative of the arts, and we’d always watch the Ohio Star Ball competition on TV every year.  When I saw those dancers, I knew that that was something I wanted to do.  I came across the UBC Dance Club in my 3rd year of university, and ever since then I've been hooked. 

J:  In the summer of 1996, my good friend Owen and I went out with some girls to a "Gin-&-Sin" night at a hotel in Vancouver.  We got all dressed up and sipped martinis.  Throughout the evening, we watched this one guy sweep all the ladies off their feet on the dance floor, just like Fred Astaire.   Neither one of us knew how to dance at that time.  We decided to join the UBC Dance Club that September to learn how to lead a lady around the dance floor.

How did you start dancing together?

J: Clara and I were both on the UBC Dance Club board of directors.  We met through the club and soon afterwards started dating.  During that time, we had been competing against each other with our separate partners.  Our relationship off the floor was growing, and we felt that it would be natural for us to partner up on the dance floor as well.  After seeing each other for about half a year, we finally decided to dance together.  We started dancing Latin together in the summer of 98, and then 9 months later, in March of 99, we decided to pair up for Standard as well.

Why did you decide to focus on Standard?

J:  Even though we had a lot of success dancing Latin together, we decided to focus on Standard because it seemed to come more naturally for us.  Besides, we found it really tough to find the time, energy and money to practice both Standard and Latin at the same time.  

C: We certainly miss dancing Latin, but I guess that’s the type of sacrifice you have to make when you really want to become good at one particular thing.  After we stopped dancing Latin, the rate of improvement in our dancing went up dramatically.

How did you get into competitive DanceSport?

C:  We both started dancing as a social activity and as a fun pastime.  However, after we paired up and found ourselves climbing up the ranks very quickly in the competitive dance scene, we got more and more into it.  We won our first major Championship title as BC Standard Champions within 2 years of our partnership.  After that, we decided to be more serious about our dancing, do more travelling to various competitions and devote all of our time, energy and resources towards getting to be the best that we can be.

J:  Yes, after university we were working for awhile.  However, we are so passionate about our dancing, that we decided to dance full-time.  This is the time to do it, as most of the top competitors are in their 20s to early 30s.   We were both in University when we started, which is pretty late in comparison to people we compete against.  Many of our fellow competitors from Europe started dancing as early as 5 years old.  It’s just in their culture, as hockey or soccer is to Canada.  We both wish we could've started earlier.  But we are very determined to make it, despite this slight handicap.

Who do you take lessons with?

C: Our main coach is Denis Tremblay of the Grand Ballroom. We try to take 2 lessons with him per week.   What impresses me the most about Denis's teaching is his technical insight.   I really appreciate the amount of detail and precision that he conveys to us with every step.  Not only do Joel and I admire him for his teaching and coaching, but we also admire him for his many dancing accomplishments.  Denis is the only Canadian to make the Professional Grand Finals at Blackpool... placing 4th behind the great Andrew & Lorraine Sinkinson, Marcus & Karen Hilton and John Wood & Anne Lewis.   In the same final, he placed higher than Luca Baricchi and Augusto Schiavo! 

  It's very important to work with a coach that you respect, and Denis' credentials speak for themselves.  When comparing him with the teachers that we took lessons from in England, there isn't a difference in quality.  Of course there are differences in teaching styles, but that is true wherever you go, even within England.

J: To compliment our lessons with Denis, we try to take as many lessons from other professionals as possible.  It’s really important to be able to see other people’s opinions and become aware of what they think is important. We hardly ever receive conflicting opinions on technique. Different professionals just have different ways of teaching the same concepts. Sometimes that’s what you need to make the concept click.  We also take lessons with Benoit and Lorraine Drolet in Toronto, Martin Harvey when he visits Vancouver, Jeannette Ball in Seattle and Robert and Barbara Grover and John Wood in England. 

How many events do you compete in annually and how much per year do spend on dancing? 

J:  Each year, we probably compete in about 20 competitions across Canada, in the US and across Europe.  Because of our extensive travel for competition and training, as well as the coaching and costuming fees, our expenses exceed $30,000. 

C:  Joel and I both stopped working to dedicate 100% of our time and energy to dancing.  Many other amateurs dancers are in similar situations.  However, in most other countries, couples receive government grants and they are allowed to teach to fund their dancing.  In Canada, we do not receive such grants, and we are not allowed to teach as amateurs.  So how do we fund our dancing?  Good question.   Funding is by far the biggest obstacle in our training.  We basically rely on individual and corporate sponsors to help us out, as well as doing shows and fundraising.   We are desperately seeking sponsorship all the time, as we barely have enough money to continue funding our training.  Like any other sport, it requires a lot of money to compete on an international level.

J:  Family support has definitely been one of the most important factors in allowing us to continue our training.  During the past year, our family started a small business called Flair Design, designing and making costumes and practice wear for the local dance community.  Clara and I design and decorate the costumes, while Clara’s mom does all the sewing.  All proceeds go towards our training, and that has been a great help for us.

How important is your costuming and hair and how much does it cost?

J: Grooming is very important as you really have to have the look of a champion to be considered a champion.  The man requires a custom-tailored suit that costs about $3000.  To compete at the highest level, you need to get the best quality suits that are tailored specifically for ballroom dancing.   And those are primarily ordered from London, England.

C:  For the lady, a competitive ballgown can cost up to $5000.  Unlike the man, the lady needs to be constantly changing her dresses to keep up with the most current fashion.  That might mean that ladies have 3 or 4 dresses per year, which can really add up.  As for hair... Because we travel so much to various competitions, Joel has learnt how to do my hair for me.  This way, we don't have to try and find a new hairstylist in every city that we go to and risk a poorly done hairdo.  And of course, it definitely saves us money, as an updo can cost around $50 each time. 

What are you thinking about when you are competing?

J:  We focus on the music and the specific techniques that we've been working on with our coaches.  Overall, we try to project energy and portray the characteristics of each dance. 

C:  We definitely concentrate on expressing the music, as sometimes you can get too bogged down with technical details.  During competition, one or two technical concepts are enough, as we try to straighten out most of the specific details in practice.

What is the highest point in your dancing career?

J:  I feel that we are always improving on a day-to-day basis.  Sometimes the results reflect that and sometimes they don't.  Recently, we've been on an upswing in terms of our marks.  In February, we won the Western Canadian Open Championships in Calgary, and we were the second highest placing Canadian couple in a prestigious competition in Montreal called La Classique.  This is by far the highest ranking that we've ever achieved so far, as we were ranked 4th in Canada last year.  At the IDSF Snowball Classic competition here in Vancouver, we were the only Canadian couple in the semi-final and the next couple into the final.  Finally, during that part of the Canadian DanceSport season, we placed 2nd at the Canadian Championships.  Our high placement qualifies us to represent Canada at the 2003 World Championships in Vienna, Austria.  This was definitely our greatest achievement to date.

C:  I think that one of the great things about such a complex activity as DanceSport is that you can always improve.  It involves so many different aspects of yourself: physical, mental, and emotional, that as long as you’re open to new ideas, there is always room to grow and develop.  It never really hits a ceiling.   (Although perhaps physically, there may be a peak.)   

What are your strengths as a couple?

J: I feel that our strength is our personality on the floor.  Even though some judges may not like us from time to time, the crowd seems to always be on our side.

C:  I think one of our biggest strengths is also the way we work together.   We get along great, on and off the dance floor, and that's really important in DanceSport.  We've heard of other couples who are constantly fighting, and it really takes a toll on their relationship.  However, we seem to be able to handle it very well.  In fact, I think it strengthens our relationship in a way.  We have a common goal that we are both working towards and are both equally passionate about.   To share that passion with someone so close to you... well... there just isn't anything like it.

What do you think the judges are looking for?

J:  I think the judges are looking for a dynamic expression of the music through movement, development of shape and energy.  Of course, a showing of strong, technical dance ability enables this to happen.

Your dancing has really taken off over the past year.  What have you done to make such a great improvement?

C:  There are a lot of things that have contributed to our success, but I think the most important ingredient for us is our commitment and sacrifice to our dancing.  Over the past year, we have put everything we have into our dancing.  At a time when most of our friends are getting married and moving out, Joel and I are still living with our parents.  Because we travel so much, Joel decided to give up his car and so we have to carpool and take public transit sometimes.  Doing all of this for our dancing has really made us work harder and focus all of our energy into our training.

J:  Yes, we dedicate 100% of everything to our dance training.   We’ve developed our own system of training, which is obviously producing great results for us.  We’ve taken a more holistic approach to our dancing, which has included stamina training, pilates, video analysis, sports psychology, music training, visualization and nutrition.  

Do you have time for anything else in your lives besides dancing?

J:  Ha!  No, not really.   People don’t realize what it takes to reach this level of achievement.  We practice about 4 hours per day, 6 days per week, and the rest of the time is spent studying and discussing notes, working on publicity and sponsorship, organizing and arranging our travel plans, and developing our Flair Design business.

C: Usually, we are so exhausted by the end of the day that we just flop into bed and go into a deep sleep.  If we have any spare time on our hands, we try to hang out with our friends, since we don’t get to see them very often.

What do you think makes a successful dance partnership?

J: Definitely, a willingness to learn from your partner. Sometimes I see couples only listen to their coach, but they’re only with their coach one hour per week, and 10 hours with their partner. We all have different opinions on dancing, but I think to make a good couple, one should be able to learn not only from their coach, but from their partner as well. If you’re constantly learning, then you’re constantly improving.

C: That’s true. I think you really have to become a good problem solver in order to be a good dancer. You have to be able to analyze what is wrong and then come up with a solution based on the concepts you have learnt from your instructor.

J: It’s all about teamwork. Not only do you have to be able to work together, but you also need to respect your partner. If you don’t respect each other, you should ask yourself why you’re still in the partnership.

C: Both Joel and I have a great deal of respect for each other, and I think that that’s definitely what makes our partnership, and our relationship a success.

Where do you want to go with your dancing?

J: Wow, that’s a big question! Hmm… Well, one of my goals is to dance without any restrictions; to feel so natural on the dance floor that I don’t feel like I’m dancing just steps, but rather dancing with the music. I want to achieve that type of flow that high caliber athletes achieve. They get completely consumed by what they’re doing that their actions become so natural, so effortless that they don’t need to think about what to do next.

C: Yeah, that would be nice.  We feel that if we can achieve this type of dancing on a consistent basis, we will have a strong chance of becoming Canadian Standard Champions.

J: Blackpool finals would be nice too! (chuckle)

Who are your dancing heroes?

J:  I'd have to say the former, now-retired, World Professional Champions, Luca and Loraine Baricchi.   Their quality of movement is unlike any that we've ever seen. 

C:  Yes.  They are so fluid, so natural and so expressive, that you can't help but be totally consumed by each of their performances.  That's what we'd like to achieve someday...something so beautiful that it touches not only our souls, but also the audience's as well.

Do you have any advice for upcoming competitors?

C: Just make sure you’re both having fun. Think about why you started dancing in the first place, and remember that always. Don’t ever limit your potential. Just get out there and dance, and don’t think too much about results. Monitor your own improvement and feel good about yourself.

J: There’ll always be roadblocks.  Try and find out what excites you about dancing and use that to inspire you whenever you get frustrated.  Also, remember if nothing seems to work go back to your basics.   Concentrate on your fundamentals and you'll surprise yourself.  Trying to do all that fancy stuff without sound fundamentals is like trying to walk without picking up your feet.  Sure, you can move by shuffling your feet on the ground, but it's a lot easier when you remember to pick up your feet.  Dancing should always feel natural, not forced.  You'll usually be able to find the answer to your problems when you go back to your basics.

Note:  Feel free to submit your questions to Joel and Clara through e-mail.  They are happy to answer your questions and might post the answer here on the site!

(Note: All Rights Reserved, please contact Dancers with a Dream to reprint any information from this interview)